Interesting, lots of detail and a bit long.  I did come across this

https://www.eliomotors.com/hybrid-cars-elio-to-launch-by-mid-2016-with-41000-reservations-and-counting/?utm_campaign=elio-launch&utm_medium=contentsyn&utm_source=outbrain&utm_content=antitesladesktop&utm_source=Outbrain&utm_medium=Desktop%2520Traffic&utm_campaign=Desktop%2520Traffic&sctp=contxt&scvn=outbrain&scsrc=na&sckw=na&sccm=na&sccrtv=na

  The Elio which is a 3 wheel vehicle that is made to be more affordable.  Since it is a 3 wheel vehicle it falls into the motor cycle category which will lower the insurance costs, nice to see a loop hole that will help the everyday person.  "  49 mpg city, 84 mpg highway for $6,800 "
Carl2

Not been much posting in here recently but it is still one of my favorite topics and I'm convinced that electric is the future.

I've also done my bit this year with replacing every lightbulb in my house with LED and buying a more efficient fridge freezer. This should continue my trend of lowering the houses power consumption year on year. 

Here is a video that goes over the developments of 2016 and looks forward to 2017.

Batteries and solar panels are getting better, cheaper and electric cars are going further on single charges. Lots more info in there too.

 

Seems the only problem with electric cars is big oil companies tend to get them sent to the junk yard crusher.

Electric cars have been around about as long as gasoline cars.   The first electric cars go back so far in time

that they looked similar to horseless carriages.

Found an interesting fact today.

Of all the emissions of an average vehicle, half are emitted in the manufacture of that vehicle.

HALF! wow.

The greenest thing you can do is use your current vehicle for a few more years.

Quote from: Snowcrash on January 07, 2017, 12:58:47 PM
Of all the emissions of an average vehicle, half are emitted in the manufacture of that vehicle.

HALF! wow.

Interesting, so it makes the same amount of emissions to manufacture a petrol car as to drive it 100,000 miles ? and manufacture the petrol which also adds to global emissions.

Maybe I'm the only one that thinks that is unbelievable.

But lets say it's true, cutting emissions by 50% is a good thing isn't it ? 

I would have an electric car yesterday if I could get my hands on £12.000 (I'm working on it) , that's about the price of a secondhand Nissan Leaf that has a good battery.   

I've been following this chaps videos for a while now, he is an engineer, knows his stuff, he made some videos about hybrid F1 engines that got my attention. Anyway he explains in this video why you should Buy An Electric Car. 

For me the main reason would be the cost savings which are large, being greener is a nice bonus to have though.

 

CO2 per mile for an electric car is about the same as a petrol/diesel car. It's just generated at the power station and no pollution in the city center.

Quote from: Snowcrash on January 08, 2017, 19:05:16 PM
CO2 per mile for an electric car is about the same as a petrol/diesel car. It's just generated at the power station and no pollution in the city center.

That depends on how the power is generated though, does that include all the windfarms going up all over the place and solar and dare I say it,  nuclear ?

QuoteUsing coal powered electricity electric cars do nothing to cut emissions, using natural gas electricity they're like a top hybrid and using low carbon power they result in less than half the total emissions of the best combustion vehicle, manufacturing included.

Read more:
http://shrinkthatfootprint.com/electric-cars-green

All forms of energy generation methods have their risks and rewards, costs and benefits. Without getting into the whole "nuclear is evil" discussion, I'll just point out that there are many types of "nuclear" energy generation methods, some of which are more safely feasible than others. Solar only works well on sunny days, wind power poses serious risks to birds of various kinds, tidal generation has been shown to alter ecosystems (if you believe the hype, that is), and of course, coal is poisoning our atmosphere. Personally, I'd suggest going back to whale oil lamps, candles and horses, but whales are nearly extinct, even beeswax candles produce greenhouse gasses, and horses make methane. Let's face it, chaps, we're going to destroy the planet no matter WHAT we do. How about we all just give it all up and play videogames till the power runs out?

Quote from: DaveMorton on January 08, 2017, 20:24:10 PM
How about we all just give it all up and play videogames till the power runs out?

It's a good plan  but I was enjoying debunking the myths, or at least trying to get to the facts.

Putting the green slant to one side for now, all the information I find about running an electric car points to lower running costs, giving me more cash to spend on them games and power hungry computers 

Play more, travel less. Sounds like an option to me.

The 50% thing I got from this video. Not sure of sources.

The guy is going on about facts, that has to be a good thing right ? we are on a quest for the truth about electric cars.

Quote"I was in Holland and I met this guy that told me that half of a cars emissions are from the manufacturing of the vehicle"

Ok some guy in Holland is going to convince me over the science and facts 

I've been hunting for the "half" figure on the web but can't find it.

It seems to me that he has fallen into his own trap of "post truth".

Did find this though published by the Union of Concerned Scientists which seems to disagree with his "half" statement.

OK, did seem a little high to me. I do like this guy's style but didn't look into it.

That vid was very interesting, it put an electric car 13% worse carbon footprint for manufacture but 50% better for the life of the vehicle. I'm sure the real world is more complicated but very interesting figures.

Now to crack the battery manufacture scaling problem. Come on Elon Musk.

The more I look into electric cars the more I realise the fake news that gets spouted by people on both sides of the argument. As normal the truth is probably in the middle.

Yes modern solar powered battery factories are the future and it's beginning 

I'm not really seeing the problem with battery supplies, I can go and buy an electric car either new or secondhand today if I had the cash. It's supply and demand and at the moment the demand isn't big enough to cause problems. Given time as people wake up to the benefits of EV's battery production will increase, it has to because it makes sense.

EV's are greener, all the evidence points to it.

EV's are cheaper to run, again, all evidence points to it.

Batteries can and will be improved over time, that's just progress and science. 

It's fair to be sceptical but when one looks at the evidence ...

No, I agree with you, Data, and if I were to come into a large sum of cash I'd probably go out and buy one, though probably not a Tesla (I'd just get into trouble, there). At some point in the near future I'm going to see about contacting Tesla to see if I can get a tour of the battery plant in Sparks (and see if I can bring my vid camera along, while I'm at it). I first have to get a vehicle that can make the trip, and that may be a while.

I do believe Tesla (Elon Musk) is classed as a joke in some respects due to not making any profit for electric cars. With all the money invested in infrastructure the opposite is probably true. But he can afford it and will most likely win out in the end.

The scaling problem is down to being able to manufacture enough batteries to supply current demand. Mr Musk gave up with China and is still building the Giga Factory so he can supply himself as it were. And current tech of batteries has to change due to not enough raw materiel on the planet to make all cars electric. Ok, demand isn't that high yet and tech will change and the oil industry is still making a huge profit and... where's my crystal ball.